ANIKA WELLS MP
MINISTER FOR AGED CARE
MINISTER FOR SPORT

TRANSCRIPT - ABC NEWS BREAKFAST - 11 APRIL 2025

E&OE TRANSCRIPT
TV INTERVIEW
TODAY SHOW NEWS PANEL
WEDNESDAY, 23 APRIL 2025

SUBJECTS: Channel Nine Leaders Debate; Election Pre-polling; Defence Spending; Preferential Voting.

KARL STEFANOVIC, CO-HOST: Joining us to discuss today's headlines is Minister for Sport and Aged Care, Anika Wells and Nationals Senator, Matt Canavan. Morning, guys. Nice to see you, Anika the PM's loose with the truth. Is that the truth?

ANIKA WELLS, MINISTER FOR AGED CARE AND SPORT: No, it's not, and I think it was an unnecessary personal attack. When these leader debates are meant to be about a pressure test and demonstrating how you can lead the nation, and I mean, that was one clip. Another clip, Peter Dutton verballed another world leader, and if this is the pressure that he's put under by the eminent journalists of Channel Nine. How is he going to go when he's actually tested by world events as Prime Minister? My suggestion, not very well.

STEFANOVIC: I mean, hold the phone. Labor Party never verbals anyone.

WELLS: That's right. Thanks for that.

STEFANOVIC: What took Peter Dutton so long to get under the PM's skin?

MATT CANAVAN, OPPOSITION SPOKESPERSON: I think Peter's been running the same campaign the whole time here, Karl. But I think what's happened last night is that the Labor lies have caught up with them. That's the problem when you start lying, eventually the truth catches up. Sometimes it takes for the truth to get its pants on first, but this has been a five week campaign, and we've seen time and time again the Labor Party spread lies about the cost of nuclear energy from a discredited Labor donor firm, they've been using these numbers; not using the CSIRO's numbers, which are a fifth of what the Labor Party is claiming. We've seen them lie about bulk billing rates, which have crashed under their government, and now they say that you don't-

STEFANOVIC: But Matty, pre-polling’s already underway. I mean, if you're going to have a run, you've left it way too late, haven't you?

CANAVAN: Well, look, that will be all determined in a couple of weeks Karl. My view on the footy field, just like the political field, is you keep playing until the clock stops-

STEFANOVIC: Okay.

CANAVAN: And you're never out of it. I'm a Queenslander Karl. We often leave it late to win, but we usually do win.

STEFANOVIC: Yeah, the shades of Mark Coyne back in the day. Peter Dutton will today pledge to almost double Labor's Defence spending increase. Finally, someone matches a spend with your rhetoric on how tenuous peace is in our part of the world.

WELLS: I think what you just heard there from Matty is five very, very, long weeks for the LNP where things are not going as they hoped, and as Peter Dutton himself claimed in January that they would win this. I'm a Queenslander as well and I was on early voting yesterday and people are not buying what they are selling. And to your point about defence, we have a record after a considered Defence Strategic Review of the greatest investment in Defence spending in peacetime-

STEFANOVIC: This is bigger.

WELLS: Well, it's a press release is what it is, and with eight voting days left there's still not any detail to hang on to it. So how can people measure that against an actual policy enacted in government, compared to a press release issued with eight voting days to go with no detail?

STEFANOVIC: Matt, that's a fair point. My mind boggles as to why it took you so long. An extra $21 billion. I don't think anyone's going to argue against that, especially given the times we're in. But where does that money come from?

CANAVAN: Uh, well, what I just did detect a little bit of cockiness there from Anika, Karl. She's saying, like, almost like the Labor Party's got this in the bag, and I don't think the Australian people will appreciate that. It's your choice in the next couple of weeks. Most people-

WELLS: -You’re Verballing me, Matty.

CANAVAN: -the vast majority of people still have, clear plans before the different, before the people now from the different parties.

STEFANOVIC: Where's the money come from Matty?

CANAVAN: How we’ll pay for this, well, we've got to make sure we can, walk the walk not just talk the talk, like this government has been doing. And this government, for example, is putting $14 billion into discredited, failed green hydrogen scams. That alone will pay for this increase. Now, all of our costings will be released just before the election, like they always are from Opposition. There is so much waste-

STEFANOVIC: Mate, Matty, Matty-

CANAVAN: in this Labor Party Budget-

STEFANOVIC: we're out of time-

CANAVAN: We need to focus on what's important.

STEFANOVIC: We’re almost out of time; I just want to get to this story if we can. After mercilessly bagging the greens and time again saying he won't do a deal with the Greens, the PM looks to be directing supporters in his seat of Grayndler to give their preferences to, you guessed it Anika, the Greens. Is that story true?

WELLS: May I use this opportunity to encourage every Australian watching this morning to put a one next to the candidate from the Australian Labor Party when they go to vote. But preferences, as Churchill says, democracy is the worst of all the governments except for all the rest. Preferences, sometimes you have to direct them to the best of the of the rest options.

STEFANOVIC: Hang on Anika, so it is true. So Anthony Albanese, after bagging the Greens wants people to put second on polling day. The Greens candidate in question who claims Israel is guilty of genocide and wants the Jewish state expelled. Is that true?

WELLS: You have to have a look at the other parties on the ballot in Grayndler. And I'd point out that Matt Canavan and the Liberal National Party have a formal deal with Pauline Nation to exchange preferences in a one-two sweetheart deal.

STEFANOVIC: So, you’re not-

WELLS: -we have no formal deals. To your point, Karl. No one in the Australian Labor Party has done more over their career to fight the Greens, and everybody is clear on where Anthony Albanese stands when it comes to the Greens.

STEFANOVIC: Such a terrible enemy but whack them second.

WELLS: Like I said, have a look at the other parties available.

STEFANOVIC: Alright. Good to talk to you guys. Appreciate it. Another week to go.

WELLS: Have a good morning.

ENDS